ITGT and GTS classes -Is it time for a change

[gary]

One question Gary,

Do you mean CACC or CASC rules? I haven't gone through the CASC rles so I will have to just in case but I don't think they even have a class called IT, I think it is GT or Open GT...


For the most part I like your ideas...some fine tuning and they could work decently...

I will have to check where i got those from, maybe I just did a typo.  It may be the CACC.
I'll check.

Gary86

[gary]

 Confirmed. Yes ideas stolen from CACC rules.

Gary86

[FriendlyFoe]

i'm a total newb to this and have a couple questions regarding how the classes are formed. Just for reference i'm planning on taking the race school in the spring with the third gen camaro i've built for the street and just doing solo1 this year because the modifications i have on it would put me in a GT class and its not a GT capable car.

Over next winter i want to put together an IT class car because GT is so far beyond out of my budget. Now here's where i'm getting a bit confused, i read through the rules and it gives a very specific list of cars for each class. People in this thread keep mentioning how a new vet would get classed into ITGT?? I was hoping there would be an IT class where newer bmw's, mustangs, and 4th gen camaros (mainly but select whatever other cars fit into the class) are classed together as i would be very interested in putting together a stock engined 4th gen camaro.

Based on the car list this appears to be what ITGT was, but based on comments about newer cars coming into ITGT how exactly does this work?

[CRXsi]

To answer your question...we're not sure yet. There has a been a committee formed to deal with this exact issue and get IT on track with some of the newer cars while not increasing the number of cars.

Having said that...based on the list of modifications you have listed in the Solo section your car will likely still have to fit into ITGT but we should have a plan worked out for IT by February so at this time it is not certain exactly.

[FriendlyFoe]

ahh now i get where the confusion comes from. I also understand why some people are suggesting another class.

Realistically my car breaks half a dozen major rules for IT. While my engine mods are minor enough it probably wouldnt be a huge issue, if i can get away with racing that in ITGT (tubular front end, and full engine mods, minor in hp as they may be) then why not bring a 400 hp car out.

I understand that there isn't enough of a turnout to be turning people away (for the most part) but what's the point in even competing against other cars if anyone can bring anything?? For as much as my little voice counts, and this is completely to serve my own interest, i think it would be very cool to see the cars listed in the rule book under ITGT as a proper class. I always loved watching the newer "Trans am" racing, and it would be awesome to have a stock spec class where f-bodies, mustangs and bmw's can duke it out.

[vintagebmw]

Friendlyfoe - I think it is important to understand that we run all classes concurrently so the IT cars race with the GT cars. Because of this you will always have a car to race with often not in your class. Because of this I don't really think the classification matters that much and I would error on the side of caution and build to GT. I was confused by some of your comments (ie your car is GT but is not Gt capable? )

To me it is simple...if you run the cars together and they are capable of similar times (ie ITGT vs GT2 or 3)  why would we allow cars to be built to different safety specs?

[FriendlyFoe]

how many cars generally show up to a race event?

The car i have would get classed as GT because of some of the mods done to it, however is no where near a GT capable car to be running with full on GT spec corvettes, porsches etc.

I didnt realize the IT and GT run together, would have thought that all the IT cars would run apart from all the GT cars.

For me the fun in racing other cars is racing other cars in the same class, if i'm just going to bring a half assed GT car i might as well just be there on solo 1 days by myself (which i do plan on doing).

i am 10 years away from being in a financial situation to build a full on GT car, by GT spec rules were talking the cars you see in LeMans racing.

This is why i was *hoping* there would be a class that is literally exactly the vehicles listed in ITGT. I would love to race against other bmw's and mustangs that with similar mod's that should all be running similar lap times. The whole point in club racing in my eyes is to be competitive against the other cars in your class, not just having who ever to race against. That way its ya i was the fastest car in my class, otherwise its just running around in circles for the hell of it. If that was the case i'd just do solo1.

[CRXsi]

I agree with most of your viewpoints about racing...It ain't fun if your car is not competitive or if there is no competition in your class. You can race any Joe schmoe out there but if he isn't in your class it isn't the same.

As for car counts it can depend but there can be 40 cars or more taking green flag at times.

As for GT being LeMans type cars...yes and no. There are tube frame cars out there but most people in our situations don't have that kind of money and run cars a little more affordable. There are several older Corolla's and RX7's running in GT classes that work very well there. Unfortunately your car would fit GT1 in GT and there is some pretty big competition and $$$ in that class. There is a good chance you may be able to fit ITGT for at least a year to decide what to do. Another option is to buy a fully prepped race car that fits into one of the other classes and is still street legal. Many can be had for around $5000.

Either way wait untill the new IT rules are finalized as there will likely still be an ITGT just not sure what the structure will be yet.

[irmechanic]

Personally I would rather run around in circles with others than by myself.  I have been out there like Gord just spinning my wheels and yes it is boring.  But you have to race to see if you (and the car) are competitive.  You can have just as much fun racing with someone not in your class as one in.  You will probably find that the challenges of dealing with all classes running at the same time and being out there with 40+ other cars is far greater at honing your skills than continually practicing the "perfect line" by yourself. 

Bring your car out as it is - see if it fits and change/modify as required - but just get out there!  As all of us adrenaline junkies out there will agree - despite how we may not agree on other things - the driving IS the challenge!

  Jon

[Al36rx7]

One comment regarding the tubular front end...If it is a mod that has been done to the vehicle,(ie. tubular from firewall forward)...this may start to go beyond the ITGT basis.  everything else sounds like it should be a ITGT . 

As Gord said, there is some change possibly happening to ITGT in the very near future....Stay tuned.

[FriendlyFoe]

i thought engine modifications werent allowed in any IT class past headers?

it's definitely not a legal IT car, and not close to being a GT1 car, but i may come and race just for the hell of it. I'll be staying tuned.

[vanquizor]

Not sure who the committee members are, but if this suggestion could be passed along it would be appreciated: If the IT rules were opened up slightly the #15 neon would fit back into IT-2 where I feel it realisticly should run. When I jumped from IT-2 to IT-GT it was because I installed a turbo engine... obvious re-class and I knew what I was doing... season goes by stuff breaks big cloud of smoke at gimli and I'm back to running the IT-2 motor in it, but the car still isin't IT-2 as I've taken the glass out of the passenger door and have a cosmetic body kit on it.

IMO as long as a car fits the class by mechanicals, weight, and is still recognizable as its original model its still and IT car. Could a guy get stupid and gain a second or two with a REALLY trick body kit (although he still needs it 5 inches off the ground) maybe... but I tell you putting on some not quite stock side skirts beats the HELL out of fixing dented and corroded rockers any day.


-Noel Mcavena-
FF1600 #79
IT-GT #15
IT-2 #55

[10cc]

Makes good sense to me Noel.

In CC, we allow plastic panels etc, as long as stock body shape in maintained, but I think what you are talking about seems OK.

The plan is to make it easier to race, not harder, but at the same time, maintain serious safety considerations. One of the main issues with ITGT is that some of the cars in the class are running GT2 times, without the GT type safety mods.

The intention is not to exclude cars but to include them, just in the right place.